Musicologie Médiévale

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En février dernier Pablo Carpintero nous proposait sa reconstitution de la cornemuse à quatre bourdons des Cantigas (n°350)

http://gregorian-chant.ning.com/group/medren-windinstruments/forum/...

A son tour Zdeněk Seidl nous propose une reconstitution de cette cornemuse. A l'inverse de Pablo Carpintero, il propose une utilisation polyphonique des deux hautbois.

 

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Replies to This Discussion

I really like the chanter system and may be so, but I do not agree with the drone system, as in the iconography is clearly, at least in the case of the shorter drones, both are on the same side and are, thus, of different length,  is not an effect of perspective. Therefore, should produce two different notes, and I think that in the case of the longest bordones happens the same, which in this polyphonic hypothesis, we should consider four different bass notes sounding at once and the lenghts that we can appreciated in the drones will produce intervals which are not consonant at the time. Maybe someone has an idea about that four notes could be at that time? But I repeat that the solution of the chanter seems great. Congratulations Zdeněk Seidl it is a beautiful work!!

I agree with you that the two drones are not of the same length Pablo. But I d'on't believe they are on the same side.
I made a partial copy of the illumination with gadwin printscreen which I pasted in mspaint.
I then enlarged it with Smilla Enlarger.
What is already visible on the miniature becomes even more obious on the enlargement: the left drone is not on the same shoulder as the area circled in yellow is not the same color as the drone. It's the color of the player's tunic.

I think that is due to a bad picture of the original, see my picture that have more quality; you can see a thin line of yellow pigment beneath the great drone that reaches the bag. In the case of the littles drones it is clear, I think. What do you think?

Attachments:

I agree with you.
Where does your picture come from?

Pablo Carpintero said:

I think that is due to a bad picture of the original, see my picture that have more quality; you can see a thin line of yellow pigment beneath the great drone that reaches the bag. In the case of the littles drones it is clear, I think. What do you think?

I have the facsimil :-)  

Voici qui montre bien les limites des reconstitutions à partir de l'iconographie : à partir d'une même image on peut arriver à deux résultats totalement différents. Ce qui ne veut pas dire inintéressants mais dans les deux cas l'iconographie sert surtout à stimuler l'imagination des facteurs qui s'y adonnent plutôt qu'à approcher une réalité historique qui nous échappera probablement toujours. Il n'est d'ailleurs rien de plus décevant que les reconstitutions qui ne sont que des instruments actuels à peine déguisés pour ressembler à un document ancien.

L'intérêt de ces deux instruments est également de montrer que cette image qui paraît à priori assez fantaisiste dans sa représentation, peut être plausible. Ce qui ne veut toutefois pas dire non plus qu'elle l'est réellement...



Jean-Luc Matte said:

Voici qui montre bien les limites des reconstitutions à partir de l'iconographie...

Ce serait bien qu'on ait un jour un Göttingen, un Dordrecht ou un Tartu pour une cornemuse à anche double!

I like very much two proposals. 

Wich is the pitch of the bordons in each case?

Pablo, in galician bagpipe exists a prototype like your proposal or, at least, any four roncos bagpipe?

Hello Maria, in Galicia we dont have a four drone bagpipe, but my propose it's really a two drones bagpipe duplicate in the same bag. In Galicia we have two tipes of two drones bagpipe (fundamental-fundamental) and (fundamental-fifth) that it's de case of cantiga 350 bagpipe. Also we have a traditional three drones bagpipe (fundamental-octave fundamental-fifth).  

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